tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-34647587.post3331702289762350626..comments2008-08-24T01:31:31.938-04:00Jeffrey Pepperhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00990997892044489714noreply@blogger.comBlogger20125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-34647587.post-62572607820590538902008-08-24T01:31:00.000-04:002008-08-24T01:31:00.000-04:00In thinking about this article, I've come to realize that there's another group of folks that should seriously read this article: the members of the Muppet Central forum (www.MuppetCentral.com).<BR/><BR/>Many of the members there are quite anti-Disney to me and hold way too much hatred towards Disney Channel's current programs such as HSM.<BR/><BR/>I wish I could post the link to this wonderfully-written article right now with the hopes of getting those pundits to see the light and take some chill pills.KINGCRABnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-34647587.post-43014383093600157462008-01-17T14:47:00.000-05:002008-01-17T14:47:00.000-05:00As an ardent Disney fan at 45, I am delighted that my 10-year-old son and his friends have HSM to love. I may not love it, but I understand it (yup, Mickey Mouse Club of 2008!) and I am very comfortable with its popularity at my son's school. I also understand that the responsibility of a Board of Directors of a publicly held company is to make money for its shareholders; the sacredness of the memory of Walt makes that responsibility a lot more complex, but the bottom line IS money. SO, I watch the movie with my son and we don't buy the HSM merchandise at the parks and hey, life is good -- we decided how to participate and where we wanted to draw the line....Jenniferhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/18383220573177416855noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-34647587.post-77434536619963731102008-01-16T23:42:00.000-05:002008-01-16T23:42:00.000-05:00I'm sorry if my comments on the placement of Kim Possible in World Showcase or Power Rangers in the Studios appeared cynical; that wasn't at all the intent. I serously don't understand their placement. <BR/><BR/>My point was broader: focusing on the franchises seems to starve the parks of original creations.<BR/><BR/>It so happens that right now I'm listening to a series of podcasts from last Summer about Tokyo Disney Resort, and one thing that comes across is the number of original stories the Imagineers created for attractions in the parks, especially DisneySEA. These stories enhance and extend the creative legacy of the Company. <BR/><BR/>I respect HSM, enjoyed POTC...but it doesn't mean I want to see them everywhere.Daddy Bradynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-34647587.post-70748202202871732072008-01-16T21:46:00.000-05:002008-01-16T21:46:00.000-05:00There are some people who won't like anything in pop culture as a badge of "cool." It can be the same in Disney fans. There are some who will not like things that break out simply because they break out and become huge.Mercurywaxinghttp://www.blogger.com/profile/10895333928502984240noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-34647587.post-57095519121224049622008-01-16T11:23:00.000-05:002008-01-16T11:23:00.000-05:00"More importantly, the fixation on the big franchises leads to some, er, strange placement of attractions within the parks, such as Kim Possible inside World Showcase or Power Rangers on the Streets of America at the Studios."<BR/><BR/>Daddy Brady, I disagree with that rather negative and cynical opinion.<BR/><BR/>I don't think such placements as those are strange at all. They're all in perfect places.KINGCRABnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-34647587.post-71541957665579017792008-01-16T06:36:00.000-05:002008-01-16T06:36:00.000-05:00It's interesting to see Jeff write this after his defense of foxfurr's similar diatribe against unfinished Pop Century published on his blog a few months ago...talk about being 'blinded' by what we don't want to see.....<BR/>I like this blog and very few others not because there's rarely a negative word printed about Disney, but because the words are measured and written from a positive, loving and respectful point of view. <BR/>If I want to read endless "I hate Disney" blather, I'll go to JHM or The Laughing Place and all its subsidiaries.<BR/>I still say everyone's welcome to their opinion, but if you don't like something, tell "the boss" and don't bore me with your prejudices. Stop visiting Disney parks, seeing Disney films, and posting endlessly to Disney blogs about how much you hate POTC or HSM or the Pixar merger. You're just a whiner, and you obviously have no life.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-34647587.post-67906066199735234532008-01-16T01:27:00.000-05:002008-01-16T01:27:00.000-05:00Two comments.<BR/><BR/>On the original post: Hallelujah! Within the Disney blogosphere there is a pernicious form of negativism that goes beyond criticism to a place of hostility: Anything the Company does today is a devaluation of the legacy, a betrayal of the past.<BR/><BR/>Everything in the House of Mouse is not perfect, and critical evaluation and commentary serves a valid and important function. The deep analysis of someone such as Foxxfur (Passport to Dreams Old & New) illuminates what works, and what doesn't, in a way that enhances our understanding and enjoyment.<BR/><BR/>Yet some within the community seem to live in a mythical state of purity where little more than <I>Snow White</I>, the original POTC, and EPCOT Center of 1986 express the true spirit of Disney. Today's House of Mouse can do little right, it's a bunch of marketing schlebs and bean counters who have sacrificed Walt's legacy in pursuit of stock options and a bigger house in Brentwood.<BR/><BR/>Well, no. Let us remember <I>The Shaggy Dog</I>, <I>The Absent-Minded Professor</I>, and <I>The Parent Trap</I>. The Company has always had to balance "art" and "commerce." Sometimes it creates projects that score on both (<I>Beauty and the Beast</I>). Sometimes it gets one, sometimes the other. And sometimes neither.<BR/><BR/>HSM is a project of moderate originality and creativity that nonetheless has struck a tremendous chord. It is positive, optimistic, and devoid of cynicism. Given a choice, would you prefer that or the adolescent nihilism of <I>Thirteen</I>? Is it "worthy" of Disney? Well, watch <I>The Adventures of Spin and Marty</I> and tell me how it differs.<BR/><BR/>I do not need to enjoy, or celebrate, every project. But neither need I disparage what does not rise to some artificial set of standards based on an an ahistorical perspective on the Company and its legacy. Keep some perspective people, it's, well, a high school musical.<BR/><BR/>Comment #2: despite all of the above, the concern I have is that a mega-franchise such as HSM (or POTC) tends to crowd out creativity in other areas. I think this is what ivonne r. is trying to say. For example, I was disappointed on my most recent trip to WDW at the quality and variety of merchandise. If it weren't high school kids or pirates, there wasn't much else on offer.<BR/><BR/>More importantly, the fixation on the big franchises leads to some, er, strange placement of attractions within the parks, such as Kim Possible inside World Showcase or Power Rangers on the Streets of America at the Studios.<BR/><BR/>As a sharedholder, I can't fault the milking of the economic value of the franchise, but creatively, it feels arid when there are so many other traditions to explore. <BR/><BR/>Or, to create anew. The billion or so dollars generated from the POTC films are derived from an original attraction created forty years ago. Where are the new attractions being developed today that will provide similar creative opportunity and economic value 40 years hence?Daddy Bradynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-34647587.post-22745198603577319782008-01-15T23:59:00.000-05:002008-01-15T23:59:00.000-05:00My name is Ray and I'm a High School Musical FanGrumpwurst (Ray)http://www.blogger.com/profile/17070035707769272213noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-34647587.post-84089068651958727842008-01-15T17:19:00.000-05:002008-01-15T17:19:00.000-05:00For the record, I took no offense at Ivonne R.'s comments, and in fact felt her points were well taken on the over saturation of these franchises, especially at the theme parks. <BR/><BR/>The was clearly a ;) in the initial statement and that was the spirit in which I took it.Jeff Pepperhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00990997892044489714noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-34647587.post-10850469086894343822008-01-15T10:38:00.000-05:002008-01-15T10:38:00.000-05:00Jeff, your comparison to "The Mickey Mouse Club" is adept and accurate. Every project will not appeal to every fan, but "High School Musical" is a charming, good-quality film that has positive things to say.<BR/><BR/>In addition, I have noticed that for teens, the safety to express interest in the performing arts is contained in the films. An excellent message as attention to the arts in schools has dwindled over the past few decades.<BR/><BR/>The sales of and interest in "How Does the Show Go On?" Tom Schumacher's recently-published primer on the world of theatre, have certainly been helped by the interest and appeal, and even the fad created by "High School Musical."Jeff Kurttinoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-34647587.post-24769130925587071192008-01-15T09:34:00.000-05:002008-01-15T09:34:00.000-05:00That last line in my post should of been: And like davelandweb, I also enjoyed Enchanted, so I'm not completely against movies like it. <BR/><BR/>It's to early to be typing... :)Ivonne R.http://www.blogger.com/profile/00794863611564790206noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-34647587.post-16643402017524820672008-01-15T09:22:00.000-05:002008-01-15T09:22:00.000-05:00<I>Kingcrab said:<BR/><BR/>And, Ivonne R., criticisms like yours are the kinds of criticisms that Jeff explicitly expressed hatred towards in his blog, so be careful.</I><BR/><BR/><BR/>So you can express your opinion as long as it's line with everyone else's? That's a nice way to look at things.<BR/><BR/>Aside from the fact that that I said the first statement kiddingly (I don't have extreme hate for HSM, hence the ";)" at the end) I said that it's not really the movies themselves. If you like the movies more power to you. I'm not one of those people who look down on others who enjoy High School Musical. You're entitled to your opinion as am I. I was just saying that I'm more disappointed by the fact that HSM and POTC have been seen in places where they don't really fit, like in Epcot.<BR/><BR/>And like davelandweb said, I really loved Enchanted, so I'm not completely against movies like it.Ivonne R.http://www.blogger.com/profile/00794863611564790206noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-34647587.post-18551670370487385512008-01-15T08:55:00.000-05:002008-01-15T08:55:00.000-05:00My hand is up in the air; loved both HSM and HSM2...and I'll even admit it...loved Enchanted too. There’s enough depressing crap in everyday life; why have to watch it for entertainment too? HSM is a refreshing alternative to all the depressing, violent, cynical garbage we get hit with every day. GREAT POST!Davelandwebhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/10720475138513029144noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-34647587.post-74120958983816211132008-01-14T22:02:00.000-05:002008-01-14T22:02:00.000-05:00Wildcats everywhere, raise your hands up in the air! :)Jenniferhttp://www.brokehoedown.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-34647587.post-75296726087437216262008-01-14T19:47:00.000-05:002008-01-14T19:47:00.000-05:00Thanks for defending High School Musical, Jeff. After all, franchises like that do not deserve to get snubbed.<BR/><BR/>And, Ivonne R., criticisms like yours are the kinds of criticisms that Jeff explicitly expressed hatred towards in his blog, so be careful.KINGCRABnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-34647587.post-59947921084790848722008-01-14T18:48:00.000-05:002008-01-14T18:48:00.000-05:00Well said. I'm a guy slightly over 14 and I like HSM.Darrenhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03104723037009416379noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-34647587.post-10920915672335756572008-01-14T16:48:00.000-05:002008-01-14T16:48:00.000-05:00I just wanted to say that I'm one of those people who hates High School Musical and POTC (The Movies) equally. ;)<BR/><BR/>It's not really the movies themselves. I mean they're just harmless little pieces of fluff to entertain people. Whatever. I more annoyed by the fact that it seems when Disney is sucessful with a certain property they just tend to milk it, which really is understandable since they are a business, but the fact they push it EVERYWHERE they can is my problem. I think it's sad that when I go to Epcot I find more High School Musical and POTC merch than I find actual Epcot related logos and such.Ivonne R.http://www.blogger.com/profile/00794863611564790206noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-34647587.post-61207504121247410672008-01-14T16:28:00.000-05:002008-01-14T16:28:00.000-05:00I agree that people aren't happy with just having their opinion out there... They want it validated...<BR/><BR/>This post has got my validation AND a little bag of "Swedish Fish".<BR/><BR/>I am in total agreement. I've always felt that the "High School Musical" was just the latest incantation of "The Mickey Mouse Club", done with modern sensibilities and an efficient budget.<BR/><BR/>Great stuff, Jeff...Doc Terminushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00940374943832177967noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-34647587.post-30985367836087372092008-01-14T15:12:00.000-05:002008-01-14T15:12:00.000-05:00Opps. a section got left out of that.<BR/><BR/>For kids today High School Musical is the magic of Disney for them, and who are we to rob them of that magic because we don't like a particular program.Ken In Atlantanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-34647587.post-58752566777447687252008-01-14T15:10:00.000-05:002008-01-14T15:10:00.000-05:00Go Wildcats....<BR/><BR/>I have noticed that this happens alot in the community, and pretty much boils down to two things IMHO<BR/><BR/>1. Personal dislike for something not really aim at them. (ie Target Demographic)<BR/><BR/>2. Not liking something that doesn't fit into a person's precious bubble of what Disney means to them and their memories as a kid.<BR/><BR/>#2 is the one that I have remind people about all time. The Great Wand Debate is a perfect example. Now for the record I don't really care for the wand being there or not. But for me the wand was there for my first visit to the park, and those memories I have of it are equally as meaningful and precious as someone else's that have memories of an eariler time. <BR/><BR/>Everyone just needs to remember that Disney is also a company and they need to change and evolve, even though our memories do not.<BR/><BR/>So take lots of pictures.Kenhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04639967346856696437noreply@blogger.com